Lambda the Ultimate

inactiveTopic Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future
started 3/1/2004; 1:26:53 AM - last post 3/3/2004; 5:50:34 AM
Manuel Simoni - Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future  blueArrow
3/1/2004; 1:26:53 AM (reads: 10481, responses: 8)
Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future

A great talk with Ken Thompson, Butler Lampson, Jim Gray, Niklaus Wirth, and Bill Joy on computer science, with many PL related opinions and bits of history.

(WMV - Windows Media Player for Mac OS X is able to play this.) - via ba-ohs-talk


Posted to teaching/learning by Manuel Simoni on 3/1/04; 1:30:59 AM

Ehud Lamm - Re: Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future  blueArrow
3/1/2004; 11:11:50 AM (reads: 568, responses: 0)
It's quite long and not very enlightening, but I enjoyed this none the less.

A couple of commens.

You want a language with better concurrency constructs than Java? How about learning Ada? One might mention that it was around when Java was built, and is still a better language...

I liked the comment about designing languages by taking things out instead of throwing more features in. I wonder who was the first to make this observation in print. Was it Dijkstra?

They managed to mention DSLs. Hurrah!

DocOlczyk - Re: Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future  blueArrow
3/1/2004; 11:46:11 AM (reads: 556, responses: 0)
For those of us stuck with dialup, you could at least provide a warning that it is a video and not a transcript.

Isaac Gouy - Re: Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future  blueArrow
3/1/2004; 12:32:06 PM (reads: 546, responses: 0)
designing languages by taking things out
Do we know anyone (apart from Wirth) who's actually done that?

Tayssir John Gabbour - Re: Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future  blueArrow
3/2/2004; 6:19:21 AM (reads: 357, responses: 0)
The tedious introduction ends at 8:35.

Frank Atanassow - Re: Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future  blueArrow
3/2/2004; 9:40:14 AM (reads: 328, responses: 1)
I only get audio on Mac OS X and Windows Media Player; is there a video component too?

Ehud Lamm - Re: Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future  blueArrow
3/2/2004; 12:19:11 PM (reads: 296, responses: 0)
is there a video component too?

Yes, but it isn't very interesting - you just see the guys seeting on stage talking...

Ehud Lamm - Re: Berkeley Visionaries Prognosticate About the Future  blueArrow
3/3/2004; 5:50:34 AM (reads: 213, responses: 0)
The panelists spend a lot of time discussing reliability, and issues of programming in the large. No doubt, these are important topics. However, is this the only issue to explore when trying to think about the future of CS?

So let me mention two more possibilities.

First, CS is not the same as SE. Computer Science should help us understand things better. There's still a lot of basic research to be done. This isn't a core issue for LtU, but it's rather telling that no fundamental CS research problem was mentioned during the discussion.

Of slightly more interest to the LtU community may be the fact that the participants focus on programming professionals, and don't mention hobbyists and whether programming should become part of a liberal eductaion. The recent decades can perhaps be labelled the programming decades. And I am not just talking about traditional porgramming, I want to include activities like programming a VCR, configuring your cellphone and using Excel.

In my opinion one of the duties we owe society is to provide better tools and techniques for non-programmers to interact with the more and more programmable environment. This inclucdes work on HCI, languages (visual and otherwise) and more.

To improve and exercise the cognitive skills required in order to excel in this environment, we should provide children, high schoolers and college students with programming experience, hopefully using high level semantically rich languages. Some people are working on these issues (think TeachScheme and PC4E), but I think there a lot more work that needs to be done.

I agree with many of the comments made during the panel, but they showed engineering bais. There's a great need for a more humanistic approach to CS and programming.